Duke's Missing And Rare Movies

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  • These,


    HAM HAMILTONS COMEDIES
    STRONG BOY
    THE LONE STAR RANGER


    These are mentioned by Tim Lilley in The Big Trail.


    Maybe, maybe, not an actor in them, but still worth
    of inclusion

    Best Wishes
    Keith
    London- England

  • Also see my post at the top of this thread,



    Please note, However, the mention that it
    is

    Quote

    SUGGESTED that he was involved


    Here is a Quote about this very subject, already
    discussed in a Filmography Comments thread, a while back.


    Filmography Comments



    Best Wishes
    Keith
    London- England

  • Everyone has their own list... all I know they are not listed in mine because I see no written proof in any of the books I have that he was ever in them. If Tim put them in his books then fine, but I have 5 others that dispute that list. For me to add them would be adding something that hasn't been proven. So far every movie I have and have watched even if it's only for a couple seconds, I have seen him in the movie. They even printed a filmography in the Winterset program we could buy during the celebration and those are not listed in there either.


    There's another place I checked and that's the AFI's master catalog. He's not listed there either and they keep some pretty extensive records. John Ford directed one of them (Strong Boy) but the HAM HAMILTONS wasn't even listed since they weren't classified as movies. Short comedy clips...

  • I wouldn't trust iMDB as much as I would the books I got the filmographies from and the AFI's info. That other thread is a year old. I don't need to check the other thread when I know what I am using as a filmography list. I don't collect 20 min comedy skits or movies that don't even list him as uncredited.

  • TCM will be showing Central Airport tomorrow morning at 11 am, est. It appears John Wayne had a very small part in this movie and apparently not credited.


    Well, the movie was on TV this morning like you said... overall it was a pretty good movie. Duke is uncredited. I didn't watch it close enough to see him because I was more upset about the fact that the audio was lagging by at least 1 second or so and it was very noticeable. The good news is I was able to burn it to a DVD, then pull it off that DVD and encoded it to an avi file. Then using VirtualDubMode software and setting the audio lag to -1000 ms it totally fixed the audio problem. So whatever software you use to fix problems like this, the time you need to set is the audio lags by 1000 ms. Another movie into my collection.

  • Hi Popol,

    Just replied to you other post!

    Yes I'm sure, some probably, most are lost.The shame for all us Duke fans is that, it's a pity the film companies, didn't show the same respect
    that his fans do!!



    Hi Keith

    I too am in UK and have some of these you mention a couple of years ago my hubby blesshim transferred all my VHS onto DVD email me at [email protected]. perhaps we can help each other out. I am looking for some old radio stuff and would you beleive UK TV stuff? Can get the US stuff no probs but UK stuff is like hens teeth!

    Elly

    Be who you are & say what you feel Because those who mind dont matter & those who matter dont mind



  • Hi

    Just joined and know this is an old post but thought I would reply anyway. I might be able to help you out with some of the ones you are looking for email me at [email protected].

    Elly

    Be who you are & say what you feel Because those who mind dont matter & those who matter dont mind

  • Hi

    Just joined and know this is an old post but thought I would reply anyway. I might be able to help you out with some of the ones you are looking for email me at [email protected].

    Elly


    I'm sending an email... hold on to your socks. I gotta throw it across the water... :hyper:

  • hi

    my apologies if these questions have been answered already.

    RE the above what is the answer whether JW worked on these or not please? was ham hamilton an actor and if so what were these films called please?

    what is the general opinion of whether or not they should be included in a filmography?

    Is there a filmography and a list of TV appearances here on this site please?

    Is there a list of radio and audio on thisd site please?


    Thanks

    Elly:confused_smile:

    Be who you are & say what you feel Because those who mind dont matter & those who matter dont mind

  • hello Keith

    Sorry but being a newbie (and an oldie) I cant seem to get round the first thread you told me about it is closed?

    Re Ham hamilton is this Lloyd Hamilton? if so I read lots of times whilst surfing the net today that he left fox in 1920 and set up his own company educational films. Please could you tell me more about JW and ham hamilton shorts.

    thanks again

    Elly:confused_smile:

    Be who you are & say what you feel Because those who mind dont matter & those who matter dont mind

  • Hi Elly,


    Save you looking, here is my post on this:-


    Elly,
    I have also moved this into Movie Reviews,
    which is more suitable for your thread.

    Best Wishes
    Keith
    London- England

  • All the books I have that show JW's films those are not listed and neither are 4 others from the filmography list on here. I have his film count at 167 where he can be actually seen in the film even if it's very brief. And how can you count small little 20 min. comedy skits? So I don't even include these 5 in my spreadsheets. I checked AFI's Catalog and even the giant NY Times FilmTracker both of which are more reputable than IMDB.


    1928. HAM HAMILTONS COMEDIES- (Fox)
    1929. STRONG BOY- (Fox)
    1930. THE LONE STAR RANGER- (Fox)
    1931. WOMEN OF ALL NATIONS- (Fox)
    1931. THE SWEETHEART OF SIGMA CHI- (Fox)

  • DS,
    You have Tim Lilley's book,
    and the book listed in my previous post
    also mentions them.
    You yourself have said that books are more reliable,
    as indeed, IMDb, and other internet sources,
    do not mention these movies.


    You must keep an open mind,
    as your views of whether they
    should not be included, should not be regarded a gospel.
    If our members, speak about these movies,
    then they must feel they are of some importance,
    and as such should be mentioned!


    We try to have a friendly board, where no one member,
    becomes an authority,
    so It would be rather pleasant, if you refrained from 'knocking' our Filmography,
    and try and appreciate the tremendous amount of work
    that goes into compiling such posts.


    When compiling the Filmography,
    we discussed many movies, including the disputable ones,
    and it was felt by the Moderators, and members involved,
    (including our Les Adams,)
    that the Filmography, was good as it can be.


    As mentioned previously, we have an interesting thread,
    relating to all of this, so I will not discuss this any further!

    Best Wishes
    Keith
    London- England

  • I'm not "knocking" anything... as many people say on here we are all entitled to our opinions. I simply stated mine and the reason why. I'm saying the majority of the books do not reference these items at all so I use another list which is my choice. I'm sure a lot of work went into a lot of things but there will always be controversy as to what should or shouldn't be counted. That can't be stopped and it shouldn't be stopped since we are all entitled to our opinions. I'll use one final reference, even the official site doesn't list them. And I had nothing to do with that list, Ethan and the office did. They have the other old movies like Annie Laurie, Mother Macgree, Great K&A Train Robbery and others but not the five I mentioned.


    If I'm going to be scolded for stating my opinion then what's the use of even posting. And I brought it up in here because this Hamilton shorts is one of the controversies. I'm not flaming or spamming simply stating an opinion. And we'll never agree because we never have agreed since another controversy.

  • Hi Ds and EthanEdwards

    My apologies if I have opened a can of worms but it seems to me that the early JW films are a bit of a can of worms in themselves!

    I am awaiting a copy of the Fred landesman filmography but I beleive that he does not list the Ham hamilton films but does list the other four?

    Also as far as I can ascertain Ham Hamilton was lloyd Hamilton aka "Lloyd V. Hamilton"
    birth name "Lloyd Vernon Hamilton" I have copied below 3 short bios I found re him.

    IMDB credits him as a director only of five films was JW at Fox during this time? Was hamilton at Fox at the time of Directing these films?

    I AM JUST ASKING QUESTIONS TO ENGENDER DEBATE AND PERHAPS REACH A CONCLUSION!
    Director:

    1. F.O.B. (1923)
    2. Uneasy Feet (1923)
    3. Ghost Hounds (1917)
    4. The Bogus Booking Agents (1916)
    5. The Sauerkraut Symphony (1916) (as Lloyd V. Hamilton)


    I am still none the wiser but I am prepared to note these shorts in my own list as QED.

    I do agree with is IMDB is not the most accurate place to get information but with a lack of concensus in reference books and amongst experts regarding a Comprehensive filmography, it is not so bad.

    I hope that we can keep the subject open as i am sure if we are to get any more information re these shorts it will come from the members of this forum.

    Thank you

    Elly

    Lloyd Hamilton
    The life and career of Lloyd "Ham" Hamilton (1887-1935) reminds me of the gag in a Woody Allen movie. . . the one where (after he has faced a firing squad), asked "what happened?", Woody replies, "I got screwed!" Hamilton, ever-wearing a squashed-looking cap and ragged topcoat while walking as if constricted by tight underwear, appeared in a couple of hundred short films and a handful of features. No less than Charlie Chaplin and Buster Keaton praised the portly comic to the skies. But fate was rotten to Hamilton both during and after his lifetime. An infamous Fox vault fire destroyed most of the Oakland-born comic's prime work: the classic two-reelers he starred for the "Mermaid Comedies" unit from 1920-1931.
    Hamilton is a true original, quite different from his contemporaries (for one thing, he looks much older, more reminiscent of W.C. Fields, Jackie Gleason, or Rodney Dangerfield), subtle and deliberate in his technique. Like Harry Langdon, his timing and pacing differ from the rest of the comedy world - and the universe as well. The modus operandi of his besieged but only somewhat daunted character (one of the inspirations for Gleason's "Poor Soul") is "everything happens to me". And like Rodney, he got no respect.
    Thanks to the tireless efforts of film archivists and private collectors, a few "Ham" Hamilton shorts exist. While not enough material exists to form an overview of his career as a whole, the lucky historians who've screened the surviving Hamilton comedies agree on one thing: they are devastatingly funny, right there with the best that the "Golden Age Of Comedy" had to offer.
    Lloyd Vernon Hamilton was born in California on August 19, 1891 and by 1913 had realized his dream to become an actor by making his film debut for the Lubin Company that year. His first flirting with fame came in the form of playing a character named “Pretzel” in a series entitled Frontier Comedies cranked out by the St. Louis Film Company. Later that year, he would be hired by the Kalem Company and teamed with a diminutive comic named Bud Duncan to act in support of stars Ruth Roland and Marshall Neilan. The two comics became so popular that they were spun-off into their own series of two-reelers (the Ham Comedies), of which more than 100 were made between 1914-17. When Kalem folded in 1917, Lloyd moved on to Fox, appearing in Henry Lehrman’s Sunshine Comedies—and it was here that he began to develop his “everyman” character. While at Fox, he made the acquaintance of a director named Jack White, who convinced Hamilton to strike out on their own in 1920. They formed their own company, with their shorts released by Educational Pictures. As described by film historian Massa: “Best described as a mama’s boy, he was prissy and courtly in a flat, checkered pancake cap, with a swishy duck-waddle walk that became his trademark…as he waddled along in his pancake cap he always seemed to be gently trying to sidestep the cruel fate that was forever nipping at his heels.”

    From 1920 to 1928, the Lloyd Hamilton comedies were among the most popular two-reelers released in theaters. Hamilton himself had many characteristics associated with Buster Keaton (a sort of dry, deadpan facial expression) and Charley Chase (Robert Youngson once described Chase’s career on-screen as “one long embarrassing moment”—but the same could apply to Hamilton as well). Were it not for “the cruel fate that was forever nipping at his heels,” Lloyd might very well be considered among the pantheon of silent comedy greats. But several factors conspired against him: first, he was never able to make the leap into silent features like Chaplin, Keaton and Lloyd—his two 1924 attempts, His Darker Self (a two-reel version—the only extant evidence of Ham’s feature career, is included on the LNL set) and A Self-Made Failure, did dismal business at the box office....

    Be who you are & say what you feel Because those who mind dont matter & those who matter dont mind