For You Gun Enthusiasts

Hi Chester.

Guns have played too big a part in the last 35 years, in this little part of the world which I call home. I know that in the states, you have the right to own and carry fire arms. I read somewhere that every American home should have one. I hear people say, if the good guys have one, then the bad guys will stay away. Does that work?

Emmanuel.

............................

I'll try one of those black beers....THE QUIET MAN.

Hello Emmanuel,

I'm glad you asked that question. Gun ownership in America has prevented more crimes than the media is willing to report. The only thing bad about it is some folks aren't well equipped to secure their firearms, as they should, but really they are few. A person doesn't really have to own one but just live in an area that allows ownership to benefit from the deterrence effect. Home robbers don't want trouble they want to get what they came for, be it goods or rape, and if they think that there is a possibility that you are armed...well...they'll just as soon go to another neighborhood instead.

Places were this doesn't work too well is areas that allow gun ownership but limit the homeowners ability to use it for protection, ie: too many rules and such. Governor Jeb Bush in Florida was right to allow homeowners to go on the offensive if they are threatened in their homes. Just watch the crime levels drop, in homes, in that area. The media wont want to talk about that either.(Ha,ha) - Ben Ferko

Thanks for this interesting subject, giving us limeys an insight!
Here in England, gun ownership is very strict, and only limited, to members of gun clubs, and of course the criminal element.
Guns, in the home as protection, being illegal.
There was a interesting case, recently, when a farmer, shot dead, an intruder
He was imprisoned, for the crime, but there was such a public outcry, that his sentence, had to be repealed.
Since that case, the UK government, has shifted, on the Law, and although, guns are still not allowed, in homes, you are now allowed to use,
reasonable force!!, to repel, any intruders, from your home,
without the fear of being punished.

Not that im bragging but I only have three guns I used to have 11. One is an 1898 Krag Carbine with papers that show that one of Teddy Roosevelt's Rough Riders took into battle. This thing still has it's original leather sling which was made in New York and marked such. These rifles fire a 30-40 Cartridge which has not been in production for I think about 30 years now. Anyway, this rifle still fires but, i'll not use it because it is an antique.

However, I still have my Mauser 98 which was made in 1935. This one can fire but as a collector, I will not fire it. This rifle has had 4 owners since WWII. 1) Mauser Museum curator in Oberndorf. 2) The G.I. who liberated the rifle at wars end. 3) Sam Schmidt (the Mauser dealer from Houston I bought it from some 7 years ago) 4) Me. Reason i'll not fire this fine rifle is because it's a Mauser Sniper variant and it's history has it as only being fired no more than 50 rounds since it was built.

Lastly, I have a 1943 produced (made by AC) Walther P-38. I have fired this pistol which is a 9MM. I don't know how far news goes here but for the past few years here where I live, there have been many many incidents where 2-3 criminals kick in the front door to someones home (while they are there) holding them at gun point while burglarizing their home taking everything they want.

Recently, there have finally been a few arrests. These jerks are gang members and they are almost always going after the elderly. Well they had not hurt anyone seeriously untill a few months ago when they shot the male who was home for no reason. They shot him in his leg I think? Anyway, they cought 2 out the 3 that were in on it. Turns out that the creeps dopiong these home invasios are not only gang members but most of these gang members have spent much time in prison.

As for laws for having weapons here, there are many but, I do keep my Walther p-38 loaded 8 in the magazine and one in the chamber.

Around here, if someone kicks in your door and comes into your home, you can shoot them dead and not get arrested (as long as their dead body is inside your home and, as long as the creep has somekind of a weapon in his hand) If a creep kicks in your door, you shoot him and he falls outside the door--you better drag the creep inside or you will be arrested. Even if this happens, and you have a clean record, it would be pretty hard to make any charges stick. This happened not long ago here as well. The homeowner shot and killed someone who broke into his home. The person broke in was chased out, shot and killed on his sidewalk. The police came, arrested him but later released him with no charges.

Chester, if you decide to get a concealed carry licence, when you go to qualify, try to qualify with a high caliber handgun such as a .357 Magnum or a Colt 45. In my area, this will allow you to carry a pistol of any caliber as long as its caliber aint over what you used to qualify.

Quote

Originally posted by ethanedwards@May 21 2005, 02:57 AM
Thanks for this interesting subject, giving us limeys an insight!
Here in England, gun ownership is very strict, and only limited, to members of gun clubs, and of course the criminal element.
Guns, in the home as protection, being illegal.
There was a interesting case, recently, when a farmer, shot dead, an intruder
He was imprisoned, for the crime, but there was such a public outcry, that his sentence, had to be repealed.
Since that case, the UK government, has shifted, on the Law, and although, guns are still not allowed, in homes, you are now allowed to use,
reasonable force!!, to repel, any intruders, from your home,
without the fear of being punished.

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I think it's absolutely outrageous that [farmer] Tony Martin was imprisoned for defending himself and his property. After all, he had been burglarized several times prior to the incident for which he was imprisoned. I think it's even more outrageous that almost all Brits had their guns taken away because of the actions of a nut at Dunblane. Why penalize an entire people because of the insane act of one man?

Of course, the same thing happened in Australia, with predictable consequences. The crime rate in both the U.K. and Australia skyrocketed once their people were disarmed. Now, only the criminals have guns and are free to prey on law-abiding citizens.

Many U.S. states have legislated the right of their citizens to carry concealed weapons. In all instances, the crime rate has declined in those jurisdictions because criminals are very reluctant to accost people who may, or may not, be armed. Great Britain and Australia should take this lesson to heart and let their people re-arm.

Stumpy, you know why all this is happening? The liberals need to pull at the heart strings for more votes. They could care less about helping the people, they have proved this many times over with the stupid laws they keep trying to pass. I just hope that day in the states never comes because there will be many people holed up in there houses crying out the moto, " You can have my gun when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers". And I will be one of them.
I am hunting this weekend for a turkey and I cannot imagine not being able to throw on some camo, grabbing my gun and heading out the the woods. I feel for you people in England and Australia, atleast the liberals have not taken completely over her in the states.
By the way I have a 12 gauge Winchester semi auto and my pride and joy, a Bushmaster AR-15 Varminter rifle. Looks like a M-16(its actually the semi auto version of the US military rifle) uses .223 ammo, fluted 24 inch bull barrel for shooting coyotes/fox at long distances, and a Leupold scope. I love that thing and if a burglar tries to come in my house they will have a big surpise, about a 40 round clip!!!!

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Originally posted by SXViper@May 21 2005, 08:29 PM
if a burglar tries to come in my house they will have a big surpise, about a 40 round clip!!!!

For burglar control, Viper, I'd prefer the 12 gauge over the Bushmaster.

BTW, we are as one in our thinking about guns and liberals.

I agree with Stumpy, Viper and Ringo! Here in Arizona, that is in the Southwestern part of the U.S. most of us old timers have always Packed a Weapon of some kind, but until about 10 years ago the weapon had to be in plain view.

Then they past the new Concealed Weapon law and there was a Mad- Rush to get one. Everyone had to go though a 3 day class and then Qualify on the Range. For most of us it was not very hard, but sometimes we had to jump in and help some of the little old Ladys and Men that had not had any training in Fire-Arms. After the law past, Home Break-Ins dropped in half. The bad guys now think at least 2 times before taking on anyone here in Arizona!

Back in the 1930s when I was a Boy and was being raised by my Grandfather and Grandmother, Grandfather who was a U.S. Marshal in Southern Arizona in the early 1900s and then later in the 1930s Chief of Police in Phoenix, always told Grandmother and I if we had to Shoot anyone breaking into the house make they had at least one foot in the house before we pulled The Trigger!!!

I am with Stumpy and have a 12 Gag. Shot-gun with a 18 and 1/2 inch Barrel with Double O Buck-Shot by my bed.

Chilibill

Hi everyone

what is the difference between carrying a firearm openly and having one concealed? Surely if the law allows for the carrying of them, it shouldn't matter one way or the other.

You guys do know what you're talking about. god the help the fool who goes up against you boys.

Emmanuel.

............................

I'll try one of those black beers....THE QUIET MAN.

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Originally posted by William T Brooks@May 22 2005, 09:06 AM
I have a 12 Gag. Shot-gun with a 18 and 1/2 inch Barrel with Double O Buck-Shot by my bed.

Dang, Bill, with double ought you don't wanna just discourage the bad guys, you want to disintegrate 'em as well. Not only burglars but the walls of your house as well. :lol: :lol:

I keep a 12 gauge by my bedside but with Number One shotshells on tap. Anymore, the feeling among the "experts" seems to be that Number Ones are a more effective load for home defense than the heavier shot. In fact, some people even recommend Number Four Buck.

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Originally posted by Emmanuel@May 22 2005, 12:36 PM
what is the difference between carrying a firearm openly and having one concealed? Surely if the law allows for the carrying of them, it shouldn't matter one way or the other.

I've always thought the same thing, Emmanuel I guess by carrying a concealed weapon, you're introducing an element of uncertainly into the mix, which would tend to give the bad guy pause. If he knows you're carrying, he could set up an ambush and take you out before you could draw your openly-carried weapon.

Whatever the logic behind such laws, it's a fact that crime has gone down in those states having concealed-carry legislation. And that's a good thing.

Hi Stumpy.

is this law only in some states? Does it differ from the east and west coasts?

Emmanuel.

..............................

I'll try one of those black beers....THE QUIET MAN.

Hi guys,
Tell you what, reading about all these guns, has got me thinking!!
I'm going to double check, anything I say about the Duke in future!!!!

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Originally posted by Emmanuel@May 22 2005, 01:47 PM
is this law only in some states? Does it differ from the east and west coasts?

I imagine you've read about the political divisions we're having in the States, whereas states like Massachusetts, New York, California and several others are considered bastions of liberalism, while most southern and western states are conservative. Most liberal states outlaw guns, whether open or concealed carry. Most conservative states are just the opposite, allowing at least concealed carry, while a few states like Arizona and Virginia let their residents carry either openly or concealed.

Hi Stumpy

I think, given the choice, I'd carry one openly, that way the bad guy's going to know what's what.

Not wanting to get into the Irish thing, but I've often wondered, if we had the same gun laws as you do in the States, would we be in such a bad way.

Emmanuel.

.............................

I'll try one of those black beers....THE QUIET MAN.

Over here in Northern Ireland its legal to have a rifle provided the owner has a licence but handguns are prohibited except for the police and the crooks.

Gun crime here is quite high and unfortunately we have a government based in England that seems to appease the people whom have terrorised many with their guns and bombs for over 30 years by giving them positions in government for their acts.

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Originally posted by Emmanuel@May 22 2005, 03:02 PM
Not wanting to get into the Irish thing, but I've often wondered, if we had the same gun laws as you do in the States, would we be in such a bad way.

Our basic gun law is the Second Amendment to our Constitution, which was written into our founding document by those who established the U.S. government.
The primary purpose of the Second Amendment was to insure that the people had a means to resist any future governments that became tyrannical. We wanted no more King George's.

I'm not sure but I don't think firearms existed in 1215 when the Magna Carta was written, which is the U.K.'s precursor to the U.S. Constitution.

It's possible the conflict in Northern Ireland would have been even bloodier if the people had been given the freedom to carry weapons. As I understand it, the "problem" is rooted in religious differences, and those kinds of conflicts usually are very bitter indeed. Widespread access to guns by both Catholics and Protestants might have made things worse. But from what I've read, those doing the killing over there never had any trouble finding guns to do it with.

Hi Stumpy.

Thanks for your insight.

Emmanuel.

...................................

I'll try one of those black beers....THE QUIET MAN.