Duke's Filmography- Past Discussion (Archive)

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  • This thread is for comments and questions regarding the Duke's filmography, a topic which has been pinned for your convenience, but closed so that comments can be separate. Changes to the filmography can be made (by moderators), after consultation with some of our "resident experts" :rolleyes: . It is our desire that the information be as factual and accurate as possible, and with all your help, we are sure that will be the case.


    A suggestion by ethanedwards was to make information previously posted regarding "missing" films more readily available, which we hope to do (trying to figure out the best way to do that :rolleyes: ). We are considering moving pertinent posts into this thread.


    Any ideas and suggestions are welcome.


    Chester :newyear:

  • Hi Chester,
    First of all thanks for doing that.
    I posted my list on the 'What are we going to do now' thread.
    Is it possible to drag my list across to this one.
    It is similar to popul vuh's list,
    but includes about four extra films,
    that Arthur and I mentioned.
    My list ,only concerns itself with, pre-BIG TRAIL.
    However, although Populs list is concise,and many thanks for his work,
    his running order is not in sequence of release dates and production order.
    eg. He shows,some of the Lone Star films, before Duke had finished
    his 6 film WB contract.
    Some of the Universal releases are mixed up with others, when in fact, he made, them under contract all at the same time.
    If one checked which studios, Duke was signed to at the time, most of the films in the early listings, would be significantly shuffled around.
    Jet Pilot, was in fact produced in between Sands of Iwo Jima, and Rio Grande,
    and to place it by it's release date would be misleading, as it was held up for years.
    To watch it after The Searchers, would show a much younger Duke!!
    Rooster Cogburn,not Brannigan,was Dukes penultimate film etc etc
    Cancel My Reservation, needs to be included.
    I feel there is much work to be done,
    but clearly we can't all keep printing massive lists!!
    The book THE COMPLETE FILMS OF JOHN WAYNE,
    as by far the best filmography, showing all the exact release dates,
    and I feel that, if these were adhered too, with the exception of Jet Pilot,
    popluls list, would be significantly different!
    It would probably be more accurate to print the books list,
    and for us to add comments to that, at least it
    is in release order.
    Best wishes,
    Keith

    Best Wishes
    Keith
    London- England

  • Hi.


    First of all I want to say that I have not put work into making a list of all the films, nor in the order they were released.


    As I have mentioned before I have used this list to work with:


    jwayne.com


    This was the site which from I found this message board in the first place since it links to the forum, and I actually thought that these two sites were connected by the people maintaining them. I have corrected a couple of mistakes, but seen others that I have not corrected. I thought there would be others on this message board that might be sitting with more complete lists.


    What I have done is put a lot of time trying to get an overview over which movies are available on DVD in region 2. This is work I have done entirely for my own sake, but since there might be others looking for these movies I thought it was a shame not to make this information available since it is pretty time consuming work unless you speak a whole bunch of different languages. Besides it may be fun to compare what is available in different regions.


    Keith: If you have this list available maybe you could share it. I agree that we can't all keep printing massive lists, but if there is to be compiled one list on this message board I think it will involve a bit of work regardless of how you aproach this task. If we have a list start with people can comment on errors as we go along.


    Regards
    Popol Vuh

  • Popol Vuh,


    I appreciate what you did, and listed the movies for the regions in 1 and 2. We've had many discussions about the movies Duke made, and had many different numbers. There was confusion to appearances counting as movies, and even cameo appearances. We never confirmed an actual number to how many movies Duke made. The list ethanedwards mentioned is different from imbd. And the other sources were different as well. So let me say that I appreciate what you have done, and enjoyed the list.


    And ethanedwards, I agree with you on the actual release dates. I happen to have the same book, and find it informative. It might be nice to get the official count from the John Wayne Estate. I bet they know.


    Anyway, I'm sure there will be more debate about the number of movies he was in.


    Cheers B)



    Quote

    "When you come slam bang up against trouble, it never looks half as bad if you face up to it"

    - John Wayne quote

  • Hi Popul and Chester,
    I do have a list, which is an extension of my early film list,
    on the 'What are we going to do now thread'
    What I did, was to start with THE COMPLETE FILMS OF JOHN WAYNE,
    and then cross reference it with about ten other books,
    shuffling it around, several times until, they all cross checked.
    Things like, where Duke was at the time,
    and his preparations for his next film etc, who ,was he contracted to,
    all this factors, came into it.
    From Stagecoach onwards, it was a bit easier, but even so, Jet Pilot, throws up an anomaly, because of how long it took Howard Hughes, to release it!!However, I considered it should be listed, when he made it.
    The more I listed and re-listed the films, it seemed, logical to
    put them all in production order, so that when you watched them, it all made more sense.
    For example, four Three Mesquiteers films were released
    after Stagecoach, where as most biographers seem to think, because of contractual obligations, the whole lot were made pre-Stagecoach, but when you watch them,it makes more sense to see them all together, because, Duke is slightly more mature in Stagecoach, so to watch the Three Mesquiteers after it ,seems odd!
    Like you Popul, it has taken many hours to get the list together, and I am constantly fine tuning it, with any snippet of information, that becomes available.
    Listing the definitive filmography, is no easy task!!

    Best Wishes
    Keith
    London- England

  • ethanedwards,


    What is the difference between the release date, and production order? Maybe you can tell me what production order is.


    Cheers B)



    Quote

    "When you come slam bang up against trouble, it never looks half as bad if you face up to it"

    - John Wayne quote

  • Hi Mike,
    I realised, when reading the various biographies,
    that Duke would say, after such and such a film, he
    was preparing for his next one.
    When I cross referenced this against release dates, it didn't tie in.
    So it was obvious release dates, were set for the advantage of the film studio.
    This would explain, why after the success of Stagecoach, they rushed out the release of another four Mesquiteers films, even though we believe, they were made before.
    Other films were delayed in release,so as not to clash with so called blockbusters of the day!!
    All sorts of reasons, skewed, the release dates, away from when the films were produced.

    Best Wishes
    Keith
    London- England

  • Keith,


    You have a list of all the movies when production was complete?


    Cheers B)



    Quote

    "When you come slam bang up against trouble, it never looks half as bad if you face up to it"

    - John Wayne quote

  • Hi Kieth


    Good work. I take your point about release and production dates a good case in point would be Red River which many take as 1948 but was in fact made in 1947 with contractual problems holding up the film's release for over a year.


    Regards



    Arthur

    Walk Tall - Talk Low

  • Keith,


    The Mrs. and I were discussing this, and think that we could post two lists in the other thread (the closed one), one list by release date (which is a common way to list films), and by production date (which has its merits as well, as you have pointed out). If you want to share your list (by production date), we can move it to the Filmography thread, so it, too, is readily available.


    The list that PV shared (by way of jwayne.com) will need some fine tuning, as some have indicated.


    What I'm thinking of doing is going and numbering the films in the list, and maybe we could discuss them and fine tune them in groups of twenty at a time (that seems manageable). BTW, do you own Fred Landesman's book?


    Arthur, you do own Fred's book. Is it fairly accurate?


    Another thought - we could incorporate into the lists the studio that produced each film.


    Well, it's pushing midnight in our time zone, and 5 AM comes around pretty quickly, so we aren't going to do anything else with it tonight.


    Good night, all!


    Chester :newyear: ( . . . and good night, Mrs. C :angel1: , wherever you are!)


    P.S. She's right next to me :D !

  • Hi everyone,
    Mike,
    just to answer your question, there is not
    an official list, of production dates.
    My list is a sum of all the parts.
    One can read between the lines in the biographies,
    and place what Dukes film schedule,was,at a given time.

    Arthur,
    Strangely enough, I was going to mention,
    Red River,as an example, this morning!
    In most filmographys, Red River, is listed after
    Tycoon and Fort Apache, but as you said.
    it was made before!!

    Chester,
    I had the same problem, with sleep time catching up,
    it was 3:30 am, when I was making those postings,
    we must all, be mad!!!
    I take your point about Fred's book and the section analysis,
    however, as I mentioned to Mike, there are no
    exact production dates!
    I do have, on my list, all the studios, which
    makes it more sensible, when you see that those
    early studio releases are mostly grouped together.
    In those early days, unlike Dukes later years, he was very rarely 'loaned' out.
    So the films, conveniently block, themselves together.
    I think listing the films by years, is adequate enough, as long as they, possibly, can be, in a sensible viewing,chronological order.

    Best Wishes,
    Keith

    Best Wishes
    Keith
    London- England

  • Hi,
    OK, here's some, to get on with,
    the early ones, which Duke may or not have been in,
    very difficult to pin the year, but it's fun
    to include them, even if for curiosity!!

    PRODUCTION ORDER

    1926. BROWN OF HARVARD - (MGM)
    1926. BARDELEYS THE MAGNIFICENT- (MGM)
    1927. ANNIE LAURIE- (MGM)
    1927. THE DROP KICK - (First National) Uncredited but visibly seen.
    1927. THE GREAT K&A TRAIN ROBBERY- (Fox)
    1928. MOTHER MACHREE- (Fox)
    1928. FOUR SONS- (Fox)
    1928. HANGMAN'S HOUSE -(Fox) Uncredited, but visibly seen.
    1928. HAM HAMILTONS COMEDIES- (Fox)
    1928. NOAH'S ARK- (Warner Brothers/First National)
    1929. STRONG BOY- (Fox)
    1929. SPEAKEASY- (Fox)
    1929. THE BLACK WATCH- (Fox)
    1929. WORDS AND MUSIC- (Fox) credited as Duke Morrison
    1929. SALUTE- (Fox) credited as Duke Morrison
    1929. THE FORWARD PASS- (First National))
    1930. THE LONE STAR RANGER- (Fox)
    1930. MEN WITHOUT WOMEN-(Fox) credited as Duke Morrison
    1930. BORN RECKLESS- (Fox)
    1930. ROUGH ROMANCE- (Fox) credited as Duke Morrison
    1930. CHEER UP AND SMILE- (Fox) credited as Duke Morrison
    1930. THE BIG TRAIL- (Fox) First time credited as John Wayne.
    1931. WOMEN OF ALL NATIONS- (Fox)
    1931. THE SWEETHEART OF SIGMA CHI- (Fox)
    1931. GIRLS DEMAND EXCITEMENT- (Fox)
    1931. THREE GIRLS LOST- (Fox)
    1931. MEN ARE LIKE THAT- (Columbia)
    1931. MAKER OF MEN- (Columbia)
    1931. THE DECEIVER- (Columbia)
    1931. RANGE FEUD- (Columbia)
    1932. TEXAS CYCLONE- (Columbia)
    1932. THAT'S MY BOY- (Columbia)
    1932. TWO FISTED LAW- (Columbia)
    1932. THE SHADOW OF THE EAGLE- (Mascot)
    1932. THE HURRICANE EXPRESS- (Mascot)
    1932. THE THREE MUSKETEERS- (Mascot)
    1932. LADY AND GENT.- (Paramount)
    1932. HIS PRIVATE SECRETARY.- (Showmans Pictures)
    1932. HAUNTED GOLD.- (WB)
    1932. RIDE HIM COWBOY- (WB)
    1932. THE BIG STAMPEDE- (WB)
    1933. THE TELEGRAPH TRAIL- (WB)
    1933. CENTRAL AIRPORT- (WB)
    1933. SOMEWHERE IN SONORA- (WB)
    1933. THE LIFE OF JIMMY DOLAN- (WB)
    1933. BABY FACE- (WB)
    1933. THE MAN FROM MONTERY- (WB)
    1933. COLLEGE COACH- (WB)
    1933. RIDERS OF DESTINY- (Lone Star/Monogram)
    1933. SAGEBRUSH TRAIL- (LS/M)
    1933. WEST OF THE DIVIDE- (LS/M)
    1934.-LUCKY TEXAN- (LS/M)
    1934. BLUE STEEL-(LS/M)
    1934. THE MAN FROM UTAH- (LS/M)
    1934. RANDY RIDES ALONE- (LS/M)
    1934. THE STAR PACKER- (LS/M)
    1934. THE TRAIL BEYOND- (LS/M)
    1934. 'NEATH ARIZONA SKIES-- (LS/M)
    1934.-LAWLESS FRONTIER- (LS/M)
    1935. TEXAS TERROR- (LS/M)
    1935. RAINBOW VALLEY- (LS/M)
    1935. THE DESERT TRAIL- (LS/M)
    1935. THE DAWN RIDER- (LS/M)
    1935. PARADISE CANYON- (LS/M)
    1935. WESTWOOD HO!- (Republic) First of new almalgamated company.
    1935. NEW FRONTIER- (Republic)
    1935. LAWLESS RANGE- (Republic)
    1936. THE LAWLESS NINETIES- (Republic)
    1936. KING OF THE PECOS- (Republic)
    1936. THE OREGON TRAIL- (Republic)
    1936. WINDS OF THE WASTELAND- (Republic)
    1936. THE LONELY TRAIL- (Republic)
    1936. THE SEA SPOILERS- (Universal)
    1936. CONFLICT- (Universal)
    1937. CALIFORNIA STRAIGHT AHEAD- (Universal)
    1937 I COVER THE WAR- (Universal)
    1937. IDOL OF THE CROWDS- (Universal)
    1937. ADVENTURES END- (Universal)
    1937. BORN TO THE WEST(Helltown)- (Paramount)
    1938. PALS OF THE SADDLE- (Republic)
    1938. OVERLAND STAGE RAIDERS- (Republic)
    1938. SANTA FE STAMPEDE- (Republic)
    1938. RED RIVER RANGE- (Republic)
    1939. THE NIGHT RIDERS- (Republic)
    1939. THREE TEXAS STEERS- (Republic)
    1939. WYOMING OUTLAW- (Republic)
    1939. NEW FRONTIER- (Republic)
    1939. STAGECOACH- (Walter Wagner/United Artists)
    1939. ALLEGHENY UPRISING- (RKO)
    1940. THE DARK COMMAND- (Republic)
    1940. THREE FACES WEST- (Republic)
    1940. THE LONG VOYAGE HOME- (Walter Wagner/United Artists)
    1940. SEVEN SINNERS- (Universal)
    1941. THE SHEPHERD OF THE HILLS- (Paramount)
    1941. A MAN BETRAYED- (Republic)
    1941. LADY FROM LOUISIANNA- (Republic)
    1941. LADY FOR A NIGHT- (Republic)
    1942. REAP THE WILD WIND- (Paramount)
    1942. THE SPOILERS- (Universal)
    1942. IN OLD CALIFORNIA- (Republic)
    1942. FLYING TIGERS- (Republic)
    1942. REUNION IN FRANCE- (MGM)
    1942. PITTSBURGH- (Universal)
    1943. A LADY TAKES A CHANCE- (RKO)
    1943. IN OLD OKLAHOMA(War of the Wildcats)- (Republic)
    1944. THE FIGHTING SEEBEES- (Republic)
    1944. TALL IN THE SADDLE- (RKO)
    1945. FLAME OF THE BARBARY COAST- (Republic)
    1945. BACK TO BATAAN- (RKO)
    1945. DAKOTA- (Republic)
    1945. THEY WERE EXPENDABLE- (MGM)
    1946. WITHOUT RESERVATIONS- (RKO)
    1947. ANGEL AND THE BADMAN- (Republic)
    1947. RED RIVER- (Montery/United Artists)
    1947. TYCOON- (RKO)
    1948. FORT APACHE- (RKO)
    1948. THE 3 GODFATHERS- (Argosy/MGM)
    1949. WAKE OF THE RED WITCH- (Republic)
    1949. SHE WORE A YELLOW RIBBON- (Argosy/RKO)
    1949. THE FIGHTING KENTUCKIAN- (Republic)
    1949. SANDS OF IWO JIMA- (Republic)
    1950. JET PILOT-(Howard Hughes/RKO/Universal)
    1950. RIO GRANDE- (Argosy/Republic)
    1951. OPERATION PACIFIC- (WB)
    1951. FLYING LEATHERNECKS- (RKO)
    1952. THE QUIET MAN- (Argosy/Republic)
    1952. BIG JIM McLAIN- (Wayne-Fellows/WB)
    1953. TROUBLE ALONG THE WAY- (WB)
    1953. ISLAND IN THE SKY- (Wayne-Fellows/WB)
    1953. HONDO- (Wayne-Fellows/WB)
    1954. THE HIGH AND THE MIGHTY- (Wayne-Fellows/WB)
    1954. THE CONQUEROR- (RKO)
    1955. THE SEA CHASE- (WB)
    1955. BLOOD ALLEY- (Batjac/WB)
    1956. THE SEARCHERS- (C V Whitney Pictures/WB)
    1957. THE WINGS OF EAGLES- (MGM)
    1957. I MARRIED A WOMAN- (Universal for RKO)
    1957. LEGEND OF THE LOST- (Batjac/Robert Haggiag/Dear Films/UA)
    1958. THE BARBARIAN & THE GEISHA- (20th. Century Fox)
    1959. RIO BRAVO- (Armada/WB)
    1959. THE HORSE SOLDIERS- (Mahin-Rackin/Mirisch/UA)
    1960. THE ALAMO- (Batjac/UA)
    1960. NORTH TO ALASKA- (20th. Century Fox)
    1961. THE COMMANCHEROS- (20th. Century Fox)
    1962. THE MAN WHO SHOT LIBERTY VALANCE- (John Ford Productions/Paramount)
    1962. THE LONGEST DAY- (20th. Century Fox)
    1962. HOW THE WEST WAS WON- (MGM/CINERAMA))
    1962. HATARI!- (Malabar/Paramount)
    1963. DONOVANS REEF- (John Ford Procuctions/Paramount)
    1963. McLINTOCK- (Batjac/UA)
    1964. THE GREATEST STORY EVER TOLD- (George Stevens Productions/UA)
    1964. THE MAGNIFICENT SHOWMAN(Circus World)- (Bronston-Midway/Paramount)
    1965. IN HARMS WAY- (Sigma/Paramount)
    1965. THE SONS OF KATIE ELDER- (Hal Wallis Productions/Paramount)
    1966. CAST A GIANT SHADOW- (Mirisch-Lenroc-Batjac/UA)
    1967. ELDORADO- (Lauen/Paramount)
    1967. THE WAR WAGON- (Marvin-Schwartz/Batjac/Universal)
    1968. THE GREEN BERETS- (Batjac/WB/Seven Arts)
    1968. THE HELLFIGHTERS- (Universal)
    1969. TRUE GRIT- (Hal Wallis Productions/Paramount)
    1969. CHISUM- (Batjac/WB)
    1969. THE UNDEFEATED- (20th.Century Fox)
    1970. RIO LOBO- (Malabar/Cinema Centre/20th.Century Fox)
    1971. BIG JAKE- (Batjac-National General for Cinema Centre)
    1971. THE COWBOYS- (Stanford/WB)
    1972. CANCEL MY RESERVATION- (Naho/WB)
    1973. THE TRAIN ROBBERS- (Batjac/WB)
    1973. CAHILL, UNITED SATES MARSHALL- (Batjac/WB)
    1974. McQ- (Batjac/Levy-Gardner/WB)
    1975. BRANNIGAN- (Wellborn/UA)
    1975. ROOSTER COGBURN AD THE LADY- (Hal Wallis Productions/Universal)
    1976. THE SHOOTIST- (Dino De Laurentiis/Parmount)


    So there you are folks,
    that was a big job!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Best Wishes,
    Keith

    Best Wishes
    Keith
    London- England

  • Quote

    Originally posted by ethanedwards@Jul 27 2005, 07:46 AM
    the early ones, which Duke may or not have been in,


    I'm curious, Keith. You say, and I quote: "which Duke may or not have been in".
    If Duke did not, in fact, appear in some of the films you list, then why in the world would you want to include them in what is purportedly a list of "Duke" films?


    Most of Duke's filmographies include many or even most of the titles you list in the preceding post but some of those titles I've never heard of in connection with Duke. What is the source of your information in that post?

    De gustibus non est disputandum

  • Hi Jim,
    It always been debatable as to to include films,
    which he may, or not, have been in.
    My personal view, is that the ones where he is
    visibly seen or credited, should be listed.
    However Jim,as you can see it is really
    hard and tedious work, posting
    the definitive list.
    Most biographers, also mention these'other' films,
    so I thought I would too,
    Many people apparently have spent many
    hours trying to spot Duke,
    however I would think in most of the ones
    I listed, he is just a prop man!!


    Best Wishes,
    Keith

    Best Wishes
    Keith
    London- England

  • Keith,


    For the sake of clarity and to make sure we are "all on the same page," I am assuming that by production date, you mean the time when the movie was made and completed, ready for release. Release date would mean the date when the film was first available to the public for viewing.


    Talking about the order in which one may choose to list films, the main part of Fred Landesman's book lists the films in alphabetical order, which makes sense if one wants to read about a particular film, but has no idea when it was released. Appendix A in the back of the book lists the films in order of release (I haven't had a chance to compare it to the list already posted).


    Chester :newyear:

  • The list in the closed thread lists a 1946 "film" called DESERT COMMAND. This "film" is nothing more then a cut-down version of the earlier 1933 serial THE THREE MUSKETEERS. I think another poster in another thread mentioned this also.


    Quote

    "I am not intoxicated - yet." McLintock!

  • I can appreciate the listing of a movie by the production date, and understand the reason for the listing. My question is why would you want to list a movie by the completion date when the "public" see a movie by the release date?


    The reason for this is the majority of the movie goers see the movie when the movie is released on a certain date. What ever the reason for the delay might be the decision of studio to stall a release date.


    For example, a movie with Arnold was to come out the Friday after the 9/11 attack, and it was a terrorist movie on an airplane. Of course the studio decided to hold the release date because of the inappropriate plot of the movie at the time, and was released some 6 months later. No telling how long it was held prior to that, but years from now, that movie (which I heard didn't do well at the box office) will not be remembered as the movie that was held for a long time but one that had a release date in early spring 2002.


    Just curious, because I don't really understand.


    Cheers B)



    Quote

    "When you come slam bang up against trouble, it never looks half as bad if you face up to it"

    - John Wayne quote

  • Hi


    I think if you put Tim Lilley's The Big Trail and Fred Landesmans book together after all Fred's was done in collaboration with Tim you will have a pretty comprehensive list.


    I must admit until I read Fred's book I hadn't heard of The Sweetheart of Sigma Chi.


    Incidentaly I came across an article on Google saying that a version of Baby Face had been found in the Library of Congress. The film was considered to have been lost, and it is planned to show it at the November London Film Festival. When the article was placed on the web I don't now so it might be this November or last.


    Some time ago Roland suggested hat trawling through University and Congressional Libraies migt reveal a lost John Wayne film or two, although as I have a reasonable copy of Baby Face taken off of British television a couple of years ago I hadn't considered it to be a lost film, but who knows perhaps The Oregon Trail is out here somewhere.


    Regards



    Arthur

    Walk Tall - Talk Low

  • Hi everyone,
    I have now completed that list.
    As to whether it runs in production,
    or release order, is up to debate,
    personally, it doesn't bother me.
    It takes hours and hours, to post a list of this magnitude,
    and it's now up to you guys to post, your versions,
    should you wish!


    Best Wishes,
    Keith

    Best Wishes
    Keith
    London- England