Politics

Quote from Robbie

The EU would not want an independent Scotland, besides other countries are now looking out of the EU.
I'm surprised with you CelticFCDuke you strike me as someone who would favour the breakup of the UK based on your name.

For me personally I thought Scotland was better off in the UK, independence threw up too many questions that were never really answered properly. To put it bluntly I didnt believe the SNP in regards that we'd be better off. That's not to say i'm a British patriot however, far from it in fact. I felt that the yes campaign was based on nationalism rather than a belief that we'd be better off.

I also noticed a few mumbles over a united Ireland but I think that would do more harm than good. I can only imagine it could cause a lot of tension.

Quote from CelticFCDuke

I'll be voting out. In my short life on this earth I''ve never liked the idea of us being in the EU and I hope this will be the chance to get out.

It appears you are one of the people voting for Brexit who actually knew what the EU is, if THIS article is any indication. I've been interested in seeing what my friends here, from that part of the world, have been thinking on the issue.

I can only hope the people who were searching the internet asking what the EU is are kids and people who didnt vote. I sincerely hope that is the case.

Quote from CelticFCDuke

For me personally I thought Scotland was better off in the UK, independence threw up too many questions that were never really answered properly. To put it bluntly I didnt believe the SNP in regards that we'd be better off. That's not to say i'm a British patriot however, far from it in fact. I felt that the yes campaign was based on nationalism rather than a belief that we'd be better off.
I also noticed a few mumbles over a united Ireland but I think that would do more harm than good. I can only imagine it could cause a lot of tension.

Interestingly support for the Union between Great Britain and Northern Ireland has never been stronger. There are some opportunistic politicians over here who feel that they can exempt Northern Ireland from Brexit but this is pie in the sky talk.

Sturgeon worries me, I cannot fathom how an independent Scotland could be viable.

Quote from Robbie

Interestingly support for the Union between Great Britain and Northern Ireland has never been stronger. There are some opportunistic politicians over here who feel that they can exempt Northern Ireland from Brexit but this is pie in the sky talk.
Sturgeon worries me, I cannot fathom how an independent Scotland could be viable.

After the original independence referendum a lot of her parties promises about the economy were proven to be grossly overestimated. We also never got a straight answer about keeping the pound and what would happen when the oil runs thin. I can only imagine the same questions would come up again and still be left unanswered.

Sturgeon tries to come across as friendly and nice but to put it bluntly I didn't nor ever will trust her.

Quote from CelticFCDuke

After the original independence referendum a lot of her parties promises about the economy were proven to be grossly overestimated. We also never got a straight answer about keeping the pound and what would happen when the oil runs thin. I can only imagine the same questions would come up again and still be left unanswered.
Sturgeon tries to come across as friendly and nice but to put it bluntly I didn't nor ever will trust her.

Quote from CelticFCDuke

After the original independence referendum a lot of her parties promises about the economy were proven to be grossly overestimated. We also never got a straight answer about keeping the pound and what would happen when the oil runs thin. I can only imagine the same questions would come up again and still be left unanswered.
Sturgeon tries to come across as friendly and nice but to put it bluntly I didn't nor ever will trust her.

What is the feeling amongst Scots? We're lead to believe that a vote for independence would be imminent at present.

Not really sure at the moment, the papers seem to think that people would vote yes but as we all know a small poll in newspapers means nothing compared to the real thing. Iv'e not spoken to anyone yet that voted to remain.

My father did however vote yes in the independence referendum after a long time thinking about it. He also however voted to leave the EU so it would be interesting to see what he'd vote given another vote on the UK.

What we all should realize in Europe and the US is that polls these days mean nothing. I've seen so many wrong polls over the last several election cycles that I basically ignore them.

I think many people have the "burn it down" mentality which might be the best move.

Opinion polls I have always felt are intended to promote a particular agenda.

The amazing thing about the EU referendum is that Brexit won despite all main political parties being opposed to it along with the banks, global businesses, the outside world including President Obama who intervened and of course 99% of the media.

Celtic fan - I would be interested in your Dad's opinion now on Scottish independence. Incidentally a warm welcome to this forum and I hope to see you around for a long time to come.

Quote from Robbie

Opinion polls I have always felt are intended to promote a particular agenda.

The amazing thing about the EU referendum is that Brexit won despite all main political parties being opposed to it along with the banks, global businesses, the outside world including President Obama who intervened and of course 99% of the media.

Celtic fan - I would be interested in your Dad's opinion now on Scottish independence. Incidentally a warm welcome to this forum and I hope to see you around for a long time to come.

Cheers. although I have been a member since 2012 but i've always been more of a lurker.

Quote from CelticFCDuke

Cheers. although I have been a member since 2012 but i've always been more of a lurker.

Well here's to a more active account from you and again welcome aboard.

Interesting twist in the Conservative leadership contest with Gove throwing his hat into the ring.

One thing thats confused me slightly is whether there will be a general election or not? From what I understand the Conservative leader would have to call for one.

Quote from Stumpy

It's been my opinion for many years that the very worst thing that ever happened in the United States was the institution of slavery in the early 1860s. But my reason for thinking that is probably 180 degrees from other Americans.

The MAIN reason I hold that opinion is that, as we all know, America now has a large black population. And blacks and whites just don't get along very well, as has been proven by recent events. And what's really bad is that things are probably gonna get much worse.

I'm not entirely sure if I completely agree with the first bit about the modern situation being the reason that slavery in the US was bad, slavery was and still is inhumane and morally wrong on so many levels, but I definitely feel the same about what is happening now. There is a lot of unfortunate racial tension in the US and it is simply uncalled for. I have a lot of friends of varied races and I hate the occasional awkwardness that comes up between us- we love each other so much, and none of us are racist towards each other in even the slightest way possible- but there are situations where society defines certain "rules" or when there is a current event going on, and it causes dissension in racial groups... I hate how society is being steered along the line of white vs black, and it is only getting worse.

It's been a week since the US elections and not one post about it here. lol I guess the forum really is dead!donald-trump.jpg

You know this is always a tough subject to engage in because so much of how these discussions go sideways is not what people say but HOW they say them that sparks misunderstanding. But I'll throw my two cents in for what it's worth.

First, the reason why I think relations between races "appears" more strained is because of social media. People with a gripe have an enormous podium to garner attention these days, valid or not. When you take that and the noted additions of people of different race and culture in key positions in the community and government, this has a powerful affect on how that message resonates. It also leads to a wealth of disinformation.

The most noted one I hear allot and even in this thread is this notion that blacks have become a large population in this country. Mathematically speaking nothing could be further from the truth. Blacks make up only 13% of our population and don't even hold the title as the primary minority anymore. And when I say that, it's not to imply a lack of merit or even suggest whatever position they hold should be a consideration of their value. I'm simply stating their demographic positioning in the United States. What elevates that sense of increased presence is simply the voice they have in social media now and, as previously stated, their positions in government to exact change for that demographic.

What's interesting is how ignorant I was of ANY racial discourse when I was growing up. I was born in the early 60's so I was not going to have any awareness of rioting and marches for civil rights. I was too young to see that or understand it's implications. By the 70's I was seeing movies like Brian's song with a black man mourning the loss of a white friend which was incredibly emotional. By the mid 70's Starsky & Hutch were reporting to a black captain, Rocky and Apollo were opponents but admired one another (only later to befriend and help one another). Toy commercials showed black and white kids together playing. Then the 80's brought Miami Vice, Han Solo and Lando and so on and so on. When I saw shows like All in the Family and Sanford and Son where racial slurs were more prominent, I saw that as another generation having to get over what our generation seemingly didn't have (at least in my eyes). I played football with kids of all kinds of backgrounds and never once did I hear anyone say anything in terms of color or culture. It just wasn't part of my world. Lucky bubble? Maybe so, but it gave me a great lesson in NOT seeing color growing up. I saw men and women. Boys and girls.

I didn't start seeing the politics of race and how it can be weaponized until the 90's. And even then it took some time for it to evolve. These days it feels like it's taught at home and I find that to be a sad commentary on our country. It's also evolved into an aggressive attitude from different demographics to color themselves as "victims" when they have disdain for another race. The word 'offended' is perhaps the most overstated, exaggerated, and most inappropriately applied term used in our society. It's used as a divisive term to denote someone who simply doesn't like what you are, thus they are "offended". And they'll point to something in your culture that, in their eyes, defines that discontent. So now we have this kind of social censorship that is predicated on the misplaced notion that when someone is "offended" we need to do something about it. This is where social media is burning our foundation as a society to the ground. People have knee jerk reactions and "outrage" to situations every day and so this flash mob mentality has engulfed this country where people have to get a consensus to get their emotional fix.

It's a terrible evolution in our society because what it's doing is removing the individual and demanding you be part of a greater collective. It's very sad too because our younger generation believe they are thinking for themselves, when in fact others are directing them on how to think by setting the standard from which they must make choices based on a list of labels.

I'll finish my statement with this... I've been married for over 20 years, have three kids and a black grandson (mixed as some like to call him). He watches John Wayne movies with me and loves him! I always have and will continue to define people by their actions, not their appearance or with words. I don't like labels, segregation of groups based on ideas or color, and I deplore those who form groups to shame others. Social media has created allot of hate groups and they try to disguise themselves as social avengers who are littered in our communication industry through the media and entertainment world. I ignore them.

What is sadly missing today is tolerance from all sides. I treat every person with the same regard as the next. Those who live and believe in things I don't are treated the same as people whom I do as long as they treat me well and don't impose those ideas upon me. I leave judging to God. But if those individuals ask me what I think about those ideas I dislike, they need to be prepared for an honest (but measured) response. I'm not here to pander to people, but I'm not interested in hurting or imposing my values on folks either. But I'm honest and I AM an individual. If you ask a personal question and get offended, that is your problem, not mine. I was dignified enough to answer it honestly. Those who have the spirit to ask those kind of probing questions should carry with them the same thick hide to accept the answer handed them.

That's why I like John Wayne so much. He never intended to hurt or harm anyone. But he had a strong belief system and if you went there with him, he would give you the tour with no apologies. In my eyes, that is integrity. He was true to himself and all those around him.

Big UK election creeping up.

It will be interesting to see how the latest terror attacks change the dynamic .